FlightofFantasy WHAT. How can Frozen be your least favorite opening?! That's the second best, after Beauty and the Beast's!

anukriti2409 Lovely read! I enjoyed reading, and i have forgotten few opening scenes altogether like Pocahontas and Frozen. I think i'll watch those films again. My list would be almost opposite of yours with very few similar placements. I absolutely love Brave, Sleeping Beauty and Aladdin's opening. I think they'd be in my top three, if i get down to making this list. I also quite enjoy Tangled, Mulan and BATB very much. Regarding Tangled golden flower: Mother Gothel needed to sing to the flower because she took the magical properties by inhaling its smell while Rapunzel's mother didn't need to coz the flower was crushed and mixed into water and was directly consumed. That's just my theory on it. For Frozen, it was shown that iceworkers would go up the North mountain and bring ice to Arendelle, which was their livelihood. Kristoff was an orphan and would tag along with these workers to learn/help with work to earn his living as well. This is important to story coz later when eternal winters were set, Kristoff became unemployed but he would knew his way up to North Mountain to help Anna reach Elsa later. Since Kristoff was an orphan, it may have been multiple people have taken care of him as he would have wandered about the city.

wanderingchild7 I love your list! My absolute favourite is of course Beauty and the Beast. Those mirrors and the music are so amazing! It is one of my favourite animated scenes ever made. It has such a great atmosphere! But my next three are the storybook openings too (my favourite storybook opening is Sleeping Beauty, because of the gorgeous score that you have also mentioned). They are so classic and I just feel that they bring back my childhood.

laylastepford [b][u]FlightofFantasy:[/b][/u] As I said in the article, I just don't get how it's relevant to the magic, fairy tale or princess in the film. I am not a Frozen-hater, I love the film, love Anna, love Olaf, love some songs and scores, etc. I just don't like the opening at all because I find it to be irrelevant to the film and not the "fairy tale introduction" type that I tend to prefer. :) [b][u]anukriti2409:[/b][/u] Thank you! As always, I would love to see your list/article! :D It doesn't sound like our lists would be that different, our lists usually have similar top halves and bottom halves in a rearranged order or we have the same top and bottoms mostly with the middle jumbled up. :) Regarding Tangled golden flower: Thanks for that theory about her smelling the flowers! That makes more sense about that part. :) Thank you for giving me your explanation of the Frozen opening as well. I understood the link between Kristoff and his future but I guess I was just expecting the "Frozen Heart" to have something more to do with Elsa and her magic powers. I will change that part to make it more clear, thank you. :) [b][u]wanderingchild7:[/b][/u] Thank you so much! I agree with you about the mirrors, music and atmosphere being amazing in Beauty and the Beast and I really love that opening too! I just happen to love the storybook openings a bit more for all that they symbolize. <3 They are definitely classic and bring me back to my childhood as well. Sleeping Beauty is my favorite score too but I had to give the bump to Snow White because it started it all, literally had Walt's signature and just has a little more authenticity and symbolism for me. :D

anukriti2409 @laylastepford: I'm glad i could be of help regarding Tangled and Frozen :) Yes, that may be a possibility that we have jumbled up middles :D

Sparklefairy375 Nice article! like the openings of Princess and Frog, Beauty and the Beast, Little Mermaid, Brave, and Cinderella. For Frozen, Pocahontas, Mulan, and Aladdin I only like the scenes when the title appears. Seems you are a lover of anything classics, huh? The top 3 are movies opened with storybook. Sorry, but my opinion is opposite with you. Sometimes the movie with storybook kinda bored to me. Feels like we are kids that heard fairytales from parents in the night before sleep. I hope you don't offended with this.

laylastepford [b][u]anukriti2409:[/b][/u] Well I will look forward to your completed list someday so we can compare it fully. :D As I said, we usually agree on most opinions if not all details and I enjoy reading our similarities and differences. :) [b][u]Sparklefairy375:[/b][/u] I love the openings for Princess and the Frog, Beauty and the Beast, Little Mermaid, Brave and Cinderella too! :D I agree with you about Frozen and Pocahontas; I prefer the title part of it the most (hence they're lower on my list.) I wouldn't say that I am a blanket-lover of "anything classics" but I would definitely say that the classics tend to be more in line with my personal values and preferences etc. :) I love reading and I love the storybook effect which is why they are all in my top 3. I love non-Disney fairy tale movies that open this way too, it's just something I really enjoy. I have always loved reading since I was a little girl and I love the way showing the book makes it feel more like jumping into the book's world rather than watching a film, it makes it more magical to me. It just so happens that all the classics started this way. :D I also love some of the newer ways to introduce the fairy tale like Brave, Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast and Princess and the Frog; I just happen to prefer the feel and style of introducing it as a fairy tale first with the book. :) I don't feel offended by your opinion at all. I have experienced people who prefer TV/movies etc. to books my whole life so I understand your position. :) I'm not offended. It does give a feel like we're kids hearing a fairy tale from a parent at night before sleep but I LOVE that, personally. I think it's awesome and I really like that style since I still heavily associate the Disney Princesses with fairy tales. It's all preference and I respect yours. :) [b][u]jeangreyforever:[/b][/u] I really love your trivia information by the way, thank you so much for always sharing this stuff! That is a pity! I would have loved for Tangled/Rapunzel to have started with a storybook opening instead. I also wish they would've called it Rapunzel because I think "Tangled" was an awful title. Your point is completely excellent about the fact that it was "Disney's 50th animated feature so it should have started with a storybook opening as a sort of swan song to its roots." That's very interesting to me that you "despise everything Tangled", I'd love to know more details why if you don't mind. :) If they had gone with the storybook idea instead then I would hope they'd have the decency and consistency to call it "Rapunzel" just like "Cinderella". (Which by the way, I feel like Rapunzel's characters is a modern spin off of Cinderella in many ways.) I really wish Disney would stick back to fairy tales for princess stories, I like the magic and moral combination. I think the problem with that is there are racist-like people in America who demand their "race" or "perceived race/ethnicity" be represented in the DP line up, yet most fairy tales with "princesses" tend to be of European origin the most. I agree with you about it being nice if Disney branched out into more openings with tapestries or mosaics etc. I didn't mind Brave's opening either as I thought it was adorable and introduced the magic wisp in a cute way. I just love that more "fairy tale" atmosphere opening, if you know what I mean? I agree with you about the peddler not returning, of course. I like the peddler character/idea though. I LOVE the muses in Hercules! (As well as Charlton Heston as the opening narrator!) I think that would've been cool if Aladdin did that with the Peddler as you said. I will have to look that up on youtube, thank you. :)

laylastepford ^ No, really. Thank you for sharing! It's neat to have someone on this site who knows so much about the film productions and what could have been so I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one happy that you're sharing that info with us! :D I'm not a big fan of Tangled myself. I agree with you that a darker story for Rapunzel that was more true to the original would work well, much like Snow White's dark original tale. I agree that Rapunzel (and really all of the CGI characters) looks better in her concept art than CGI but as you know, I kind of despise the "CGI" myself. It doesn't bother me when the DPs are portrayed as "Mary Sue", I actually prefer that over the opposite. One thing that always drew me to Disney, especially Walt's original concept and goals for Disney, was the wholesomeness and family values. I suppose that is why I don't despise Rapunzel though there are so many things about her film that I do despise and think was done just awfully. It didn't bother me to see her so "Mary Sue" and multitalented but I would've rather they actually took advantage of that by showing her with more development, as you said, since she's supposed to be stuck in a tower for so long. I always liked the concept that she used her free time to exhibit the spirit of adventure, knowledge and culture by not letting that free time go to waste and trying out so many new things. Unfortunately, they didn't show it much. I personally thought they should've showed those skills actually come into play for her later so that they actually meant something and were worth the time and energy they required. I completely agree with you about Flynn/Eugene pandering to teenage girls and I think it's horrible of Disney to push the bad boy image to "princess" type girls who are more likely to be innocent and naïve. This has been my problem with Disney for a long time though as you will see only really the first 4/11 "princes" are actually the traditional Prince Charming and every guy since then has been someone for the Princess to fix or help. I personally don't like that at all. I love some of the princes who don't fall under the original 4 "Prince Charming" categories but I think it's important to show girls that they should be focusing more on the gentlemen who treat them right then trying to fix a bad boy which is completely unrealistic in real life. You may or may not know this about me but Mother Gothel was actually exactly like my real mother so I thought she was the most brilliant part of the entire film. I have to take your word from it when you see we don't see enough from her because I recognize her so well that I might have picked up on more than the average audience does. To me, it is very obvious that she doesn't love Rapunzel at all and that she only loves her for her hair. I could tell easily by the way she cared about Rapunzel's hair and would stare at it but ignore Rapunzel. Also the way she would lose her temper with Rapunzel over nothing and seemed to be exasperated by the mere presence of Rapunzel showed me there was no genuine love there. Also the way Mother Gothel tried to make Rapunzel feel completely inadequate is something most enemies wouldn't even try. She told Rapunzel that she was unlovable, too fat, too naïve, etc. No one who loved someone could tear that person down like that unless they had no feelings for them or were getting something great out of it. I could feel there was no love from Mother Gothel to Rapunzel at all but like I said, I had the advantage because she reminded me exactly of my mother so it was all very obvious for me personally. There was no question for me how incredibly awful Mother Gothel is and she is one of the worst villains to me. Especially the way she used her position in Rapunzel's mind as her mother to say all of those horrible things was just despicable and malicious to me. Women know that mothers are the most important thing to children, often held up on a pedestal, so to say those things to Rapunzel from who she thought was her mother was actually kind of heart-breaking for me to watch. I completely agree with you about the pub scene and I despise that scene, myself! I think it's horrible for children and sends a completely unrealistic message. I also hate Eugene for sending her in there. I think you and I both realistically know what those ruffians would really have done to Rapunzel and lone Eugene could not have done anything to stop it. That is one of the main reasons I hate Eugene as a prince, he basically took Rapunzel to get debased by thugs but being a Disney movie, it didn't work. In real life, a girl going to a pub with some scoundrel might be experiencing her last day on Earth. I HATE when Disney shows such awful and horrible messages like that to children because it goes against absolutely everything that Walt stood for and started the company for. I don't think the songs are great either and I even like Mandy Moore quite a bit and love her voice. I like the song "When Will My Life Begin?" and I LOVE "Mother Knows Best & Reprise" because I think it perfectly captures the villain as I know her but otherwise I personally don't like any of the other songs, including "I See The Light" and I hate that scene because I see an older scoundrel realizing he's got a virgin princess and he's a master manipulator. I hate that. I don't mind Disney branching out to other source material (Pocahontas, Mulan, Moana) either but I personally don't like the way the fans treat Disney about it. They expect Disney, a company owned by white people and started by a white guy in a country with still mostly white people, to get the other cultures done in their own way but they want it to still be Europeanized because they want their culture to be shown like European culture just with different skin colors and outfits etc. I hate that. I care about the story, not the race of the DP. I am of incredibly mixed race (I am British, Japanese, Polish, Native American, Spanish/Portuguese, Italian/Greek, Polynesian, Filipino, etc.) and I certainly don't mind these other cultures but I am also not racist. I don't expect Disney to show all of these cultures simply because they are relative to my personal genetics. I don't make selfish claims like "finally Disney is going to do a ___ princess, I hope they get it right this time!" I just hate that attitude and I think it's that exact attitude from the "audience" that kills the Disney magic because instead of focusing on what they do best, they've got to focus on how all of these different political/racial groups are going to react because they want their race to be represented in a specific manner. It just makes it so complicated and I hate it. If you (meaning them) love Disney so much that you want them to cover your race, then let them! If you think they can't handle it or it's not to your liking then why don't you make your own company and design princesses? It just becomes this socio-political agenda piece instead of back to it's roots of being a fairy tale story with a universal moral, which I love. Sometimes it's like these people don't even realize how different European culture is from their own because they'll get mad that "magic fairy godmothers" or other things you mentioned will be missing. Then when Disney does try to show them more accurately to their cultures, they get called "racist" or other things. When it comes to the non-European (and really non-Asian because Asians don't complain too much or get that involved in social politics in America) characters, Disney can't win for losing. It's a double edged sword and often leads to controversy which I believe takes away from the characters. I also agree with you about the character issue. It's just a thought but I always thought once Mulan came out that Disney should just have separate "princess" and "heroine" franchises. I don't like adding the heroines into the DP line up because I think it completely takes away from the "princess" characters. I am not saying princesses cant be heroines, I am saying that consistency would be nice. I agree with you that if they're going to have non-princess characters now then why in the world wouldn't they add in the (better in my opinion) heroines of yesteryear as you mentioned? If they had the lines separate then I think it would be good because some girls do prefer the "princess" and what comes with that (i.e. tea parties, beautiful gowns, breathtaking balls and fairy godmothers etc) whereas the girls that seem to prefer "heroines" don't want to see that stuff as much and I don't think it's advantageous of Disney to try to mix and match the way they are. I completely agree with you 100% about the DPs getting represented by stock traits that aren't actually representative of their true characters and I'm glad you see it too. :D I also wish the lineup would actually represent the princesses from the original films, rather than their condensed versions. Most kids today don't even realize Cinderella is a red-head not a blonde. I think there are plenty of more European cultures to explore. Unfortunately in America, there is this racism against whites (and Asians) that all of their cultures are the same or something. If Disney made another European princess then we will hear what we have heard every time a European Disney princess is made "Great, another white princess for the line up!" I cant stand that racism towards Europeans in America which makes no sense to me since America was founded by a mixed group of Europeans to begin with. (There is also the problem that a lot of Americans don't realize that Spain is a part of Europe. I know it sounds obvious but a lot of Americans actually believe that Spanish is their own separate race that is near Europe but not European or something.) There is so much racism against "white" people as well that if Disney did make a Spanish European, what color would they make her? People from Spain range from a darker Mediterranean skin color to a more northern (Anglo-Saxon) whiter color. If they are drawn darker then there will be lighter Spanish people who will complain "why do we always have to presented so dark?" If they are drawn lighter then there will be darker Spanish (or non-Spanish) people who will complain "why are you trying to make us more white?" *sigh...* I just think there's too much racism in America right now against Europeans which makes it harder for Disney to incorporate other cultures for so many reasons. I agree with you, I'd love to see more European cultures (especially since I recognize how much variation there is between cultures) but I don't know how the rest of the audience would feel. Some Americans don't even know what to call Italians, they think they're a separate group or non-existent because although they are European, they are not anglo-European so that confuses the majority of racist Americans. I would also absolutely adore a Turkish Princess from the Ottoman Empire as I LOVE ancient cultures. Again, I think some Americans wouldn't know how to perceive that race though, unfortunately. I am so glad that you don't see Mulan as a proper Chinese princess either! I see her as being so Americanized!! Personally, I absolutely love and adore Japanese culture over Chinese so I'd rather just see a proper Japanese princess but I don't mind another Chinese one. I know at one point, Disney was going to do a Chinese princess who falls in love with a British Prince Charming but instead they found that poem for the soldier Mulan and decided to go with that instead. (Plus it was the 1990s when feminism and girl power was all the rage.) I would like to see an Indian princess too. If any group is "not represented" in the DP line up, it's eastern-logic/culture. Americans are very turned off by eastern culture and don't respect it so it would be really hard for Disney to do a great and accurate eastern-cultured princess. I agree that Indians wouldn't have an issue if Disney westernized their fairytale. Most Asian cultures have shifted towards westernized culture and have a balance that is neither fully western nor fully eastern. I know Indians are not Asians but they do also have a somewhat mixed view between western and eastern. By the way, you said "Stemming from that part of the world though, I can say though that Indians wouldn't have an issue if Disney took a western fairytale..." So I hope you don't mind me asking, are you Indian? Do you live in India? :) Personally, I would think most African stories lined up by Disney wouldn't see the green light because of the racial issues in America, as I mentioned before. Most races will never have a unified consensus on their portrayal which is why I think Disney has such a hard problem representing other races. Whites and Asians tend not to care as much so they don't complain as much, which is also why Disney does European fairy tales better, they don't have to worry about "racial" or "cultural" etc. complaints to that degree. Not all white people or Europeans or Scottish or whatever culture being represented is going to agree but they usually don't turn it into some racial, "Disney is trying to take away from our culture" crap argument. In my opinion. :) I hope I didn't offend you at all. I love speaking to you in such detail as you have so much to offer. I just have a strong personality so I hope you will excuse that and not take any offense towards anything as I absolutely don't mean any whatsoever. :D

laylastepford Wow, I never heard a "Mary Sue" put that way before but I totally understand where you are coming from. You are very eloquent with your explanations! Every time I have ever heard "Mary Sue" types as "unrealistic", I honestly never got it until now. Where I grew up, a "Mary Sue" was basically and good person who didn't look for trouble. I understood the term to be much more vague and condemning of those who didn't want to partake in illegal or mischievous etc. activities. The way you described it made a lot of sense though, especially in regards to Rapunzel. I agree the classics have flaws and are not as perfect as Rapunzel is. I suppose when I see people say the classics are unrealistic, I also then associate that "Mary Sue" to just mean uncommonly sweet or good as I see the classics as being "uncommon" not "unrealistic". It makes a lot of sense the way you describe Rapunzel as being "unrealistically perfect" and I can totally see where you are coming from. Especially with winning over Maximus and the ruffians and as you brilliantly pointed out, her ability to swim despite never being in water her whole life. I never had it explained to me like this before but by your explanation, I completely see where you are coming from and why. :D The version of Rapunzel you explained makes a lot more sense. For someone who is raised the way Rapunzel is, I always thought it was very brave and daring for her to not only pursue her desire to go out but also reckless of her to try and manipulate a thief into getting it done. I also much prefer the idea of the prince figure repeatedly visiting the tower, as more true to the original. I must say, the thing that upset or disappointed me most about "Tangled" was how much they changed the original fairy tale which had a great story to begin with and didn't need much changing. I think the fact that they went with the title "Tangled" was very representative of how they were completely changing it up, and not for the better in my opinion. I also would have preferred the version of the "prince" to be much more of a genuinely good character at heart like your description. I never minded Aladdin for being a thief, it hardly stood out to me because he truly was a "diamond in the rough". I saw Eugene as the type of guy who exploits the idea of guys like Aladdin to get more sympathy and leeway for their horrible behavior and demeanor. You are right about us never seeing how the poor suffer in fairytale kingdoms. Even Aladdin's Agrabah was very tame considering the reality of the source. I think it would be smarter for Disney to play up the suffering in the kingdom because it just makes the story more accurate and understandable to me. I don't believe anything graphic has to be shown but I think the princesses from older time periods have become too modernized which disrupts the story, at least for me. I always take each film in the context of it's projected time and place. I know many other people take it in today's context and I think Disney makes it easier by showing it more in today's context than it's more accurate and historical one. I'm so glad you see where I am coming from about Eugene leading Rapunzel into that pub. Sometimes I say it to others and they just want to ignore it or get upset with me for bringing up the realistic possibilities. Like you though, I don't even want to think about what would've happened if it hadn't been a Disney movie but I don't like Disney for setting it up that way. The older films may have had some more magic-centric films but they still maintained a great aspect of realism, I thought, by including a balance of truth even if it was harsh or inconvenient. A great example to me would be Sword in the Stone which is one of my all-time favorite Classic Disney movies. I completely agree with you 100% that the Beast is the best of the non-Prince Charmings. Personally, I see Beast as a Prince Charming who didn't have parents to raise him the right way. Both the Beast and Kristoff come off very much to me like natural gentlemen at heart who unfortunately were just not raised to embrace that part of themselves. Being alone, they grew accustomed to not acting that way but as soon as a beautiful woman was around they both immediately naturally acted like gentlemen in many ways. To me, it showed they were always gentlemen at heart much like Cinderella was always a graceful princess at heart even though she wasn't raised in a way that embraced that part. Yet it still retained. I agree with you that it was the one example of the princess fixing the prince that worked. I would also like to add that I personally see it as being an even bigger symbolism of how a great woman can change a good man who is just misunderstood. I don't believe great women can change bad men who are bad at heart. Lots of good men, however, end up as "loners" until they meet the woman who makes them care about society and a future family. I see that a lot with Belle and Beast as well as Anna and Kristoff. If that all makes sense. :D That is why I see such a huge difference between Belle/Beast & Tiana/Naveen or Rapunzel/Eugene. No worries about my own mother. I have moved on and healing a lot from it now. :D Yes, if you ever do see it again then I'd love to know what you thought. You seem very perceptive so I'm sure you'll be able to tell better than I could since I am too biased and not objective enough with this subject. I'm usually not great with nuances but with this one film, I pick up on them all. Little moments like whenever Rapunzel gets close to Mother Gothel the way a daughter would to her mother, Mother Gothel gets very uncomfortable and alert. Mothers shouldn't act like that when their children hug up on them. Also just the way Mother Gothel handles everything is so cruel. She could've told Rapunzel in the Reprise that Eugene was a lying and manipulating thief who was a no good person. Instead, Mother Gothel touched on the fact that Eugene might be manipulating but that the real reason was because Rapunzel wasn't good enough to be loved. Mother Gothel's way of getting Rapunzel to not trust Eugene wasn't by doubting Eugene but by making her doubt herself. As she said "Likes you? Please, Rapunzel, that's demented... Why would he like you? Come on now - really! Look at you - you think that he's impressed?" Again that could be a personal bias because my own mother has spoken to me that way when I told her I was getting married and it's just awful. It's one thing for a mother to say "I really don't trust him and I think you're making a huge mistake." It's quite another to have a mother say something like "Yeah, good luck with that. I can't believe you actually think he could be in love with YOU." It's horribly degrading and I wouldn't wish for an enemy's mother to talk to them that way. Also there are many scenes where Mother Gothel isn't even looking at Rapunzel, she's looking at her hair. At one point, she even says "I love you" to Rapunzel but she's holding and looking down at her hair cradled in her arms while Rapunzel is standing behind her and out of sight. I think it could've been more powerful to have Mother Gothel act more like a sincere mother but I must admit from the inside that a mother is held on such a pedestal in the brain that a child will often make excuses for their mother's seemingly inappropriate or unpleasant behavior. So to me, it was realistic that the audience could see how fake Mother Gothel was but Rapunzel couldn't since she was too close to the situation. I, myself, didn't realize exactly how awful my mother was until I moved out and got my own place. I always knew she wasn't like other mothers but in retrospect, I gave her an unrealistic benefit of the doubt and my brain didn't want to accept the reality behind her actions and words. No child wants to believe their mother doesn't really love them so even when they see the lack of love, they find an excuse for it. I completely agree with you that showing Gothel to be much more motherly would definitely have portrayed her much more for the monster she is. I think it also would've made the more realistic impact of recognition for Rapunzel when she finally realized that her mother wasn't what she seemed. That being said, I do think they still should've showed some of the nuanced stuff I mentioned earlier that do giveaway that she doesn't really love Rapunzel because I think those signs are always there. That is too cute about Rapunzel being intrigued by this Bastion's facial hair! I can definitely see why this version would make you dislike Tangled that much more, I feel the same! I think you are probably right about Disney being afraid of the audience losing interest. If we're being honest, we're in a generation of instantaneous culture where kids are glued to the TVs and don't have the attention span to read a magazine, let alone a book or novel. Some of the comments I write have intimidated people, much to my surprise. At least, people have complained about the length and not the actual context. I have also seen reviews of great movies over the last 15 years that some people write off as "slow" not understanding the character and story development taking place. I read a lot as a child though, so I'm not quite as affected as the children today. It seems like you read too. :D Oh man! I cant stand people demanding Disney princesses with disabilities or fat etc. to pander to all audiences! The ethnicities are one thing but some people take it too far. I sincerely think people need to realize that much to their chagrin, audiences don't like looking at all types of people exactly the same. Getting into right and wrong is a secondary discussion. Primarily though, ratings go up with beautiful princesses and down with fat handicapped princesses and that's not going to change. I think it's ridiculous to hold Disney to some unrealistically high expectation of representing every type of desirable and undesirable character on Earth. I completely agree most of those things don't even work in the context of historical, period-piece fairy tales. Asians don't complain much and they don't get involved in the social politics of America so personally, I'm not surprised at all that we rarely hear requests for them. They are the one non-European group that disproves "European racism towards all other races" the most so I think a lot of non-European groups try to forget they exist. Honestly, it bothers me how the general public cries about stereotypes and racism etc. then turn around and hypocritically always group in all Europeans and all Asians as being the same. I find that of all the American public who cry about race and racial problems, etc. they're not actually that educated or informed about race at all. They base most of their arguments on skin color. I have read that Indians and Arabians don't consider themselves Asians. I have read that Indians consider themselves to be "West Asian" but separate from most Asians and Arabians consider themselves to be (tanned) Caucasians. I have also heard what I believe was to be a joke about Russians being "Eurasian" because they're such a hybrid of Europeans and Asians but still so different form both. (I have done genetic tests as I am very interested in genetics and science.) Mostly I have read that Indians are their own race; Chinese, Japanese & I believe Bengali are all considered Asian; Malaysian & Indonesian considered Pacific Islander , Russians and Arabians considered Caucasians with Arabians as West Caucasian, a sub group under Caucasians. Of course, this is when I look at races which studies show only 3-5 whereas there are thousands of ethnicities. Most of the general public doesn't even understand the difference between races and ethnicities which I think also creates confusion when it comes to Europeans and Asians. I think the reason why we don't have a Japanese princess is because despite the large interest of Disney in Japan, they're isn't enough of an economical market for a purely Japanese princess. Most Japanese love the European princesses and don't complain to see a specifically Japanese one so the market would be too limited since it wouldn't be a new untapped market to exploit. I hate to talk about Disney that way but just being honest since it's not run by Walt or his brother Roy anymore but a board full of people who only care about profits and not Walt's morals or goals. I see what you are saying about Mulan, my mistake! I agree with you and I see many traditional elements to Mulan but I also see her very westernized as well, what with the gender role reversal. That makes so much sense with what you said about Disney toning down the westernization of Mulan! It would explain why her character is so conflicting. One one hand, she is hailed as this feminist icon who pulls off being a man in war and saving an entire country but on the other hand, she is just a girl-next-door who is clumsy and doesn't fit in to the super graceful, demure woman that Chinese culture expects her to be. I think the unhappy Chinese girl who gets whisked away to the west by her British Prince Charming would've been a great story. I think a lot of European and American woman might have gotten upset but I doubt many Asians would have been. As it is right now, many Asians (and Russians) are becoming (and have been) mail order brides to American men or trying to move here and find an American man to marry rather than stay in their home country. I don't think they'd be offended by it. Oh, thank you for sharing that with me! I think you have a really nice balance of western and eastern logic so I am not too surprised that you are not American. You come off much more cultured, eloquent and wiser than most American women today. (I am not trying to be down on American women, simply making an observation and giving you due credit that I think you deserve. :D) It is hard for me to meet others that I can relate to because although I am American and there are many things I love about American culture, I don't like many aspects of the current American culture going on. My way of thinking and personality are both influenced by my western and eastern genetics as well so some Americans see me as harsh/blunt, old-timey/traditional, etc. I love a lot of aspects of eastern culture, primarily in relation to respect, accountability and honor. American media, much more than actual Americans, is not at all about "respect, accountability and honor" but much more into "fame, desires and (unearned) self-esteem". That is why I personally think Disney cannot show a princess with Eastern logic. (Also, Americans today seem to be so uncultured and have no knowledge of foreign cultures at all. They don't respect the differences because most of them don't even recognize the differences or why those differences are there. Many Americans are so quick to morally judge things based on the "American way" of life and no other ways.) I think you are right though that if they did try a culture that has more eastern influences, they should definitely lean towards Indian. I agree it would make much more sense than Mulan. Who is Elena that Disney is making? Is that another new DP film to be coming after Moana? It's amazing that you wrote Italian Renaissance because as soon as I read "Italian princess" I was thinking o the Renaissance and how much culture that would have to offer! Have you ever seen Ever After with Drew Barrymore and Angelica Huston? It was a Cinderella story that incorporated Leonardo Da Vinci in an absolutely wonderful way, in my opinion. Hmm.. That Danish fairy tale you are reading sounds very interesting! I can see why you would think I wouldn't be interested. It does sound interesting but I can be sensitive. If there is no rape in it then I would probably be able to handle it. I can handle reading unpleasant things much better than watching/seeing them. :D I have read some original fairy tale stories that aren't Disney-fied and I don't mind darker origins as I think they often give more weight to the moral of the story. I'm so glad I haven't offended you with my strong opinions! I feel like I have learned a lot from you and your insights are very much appreciated and respected by me! Thank you for your time. :)

laylastepford Yes, I like more accurate pieces myself so I also don’t prefer Disney modernizing a period piece. Children learn history in school and I don’t know what Disney stands to gain by confusing them. That’s funny what you said about Rapunzel’s cringe-worthy phrases. Honestly, I don’t even remember them. Tangled is the movie that I remember the story and events very well but the details just don’t seem important enough to care about. It’s so awesome for me to talk to you as someone who understands and agrees about the historical context! I also can’t stand when people complain about the ages of the DPs getting married without taking the time period into context. Same when it comes to arranged marriages. I completely respect the fact that today arranged marriages are seen more as a violation of human rights, especially by women. What I don’t respect, is when people try to say that Jasmine or Merida’s parents didn’t love them or treated them horribly by trying to force them to get married before they were ready. Geez… It’s rare that these people recognize that Jasmine and Merida’s characters are progressive for their times and that their parents were just going on law and tradition, with no malicious intent towards their daughter. I understand people even making the argument “no one should have to be forced into a marriage they don’t agree to” but then they act like the parents from that time should feel the exact same and have the beliefs that people have today, hundreds of years later. By the way, I met my husband at the age of 20 (and he is much older than I). We got married when I was 22. I am still in my mid-20s, we have no kids, if we ever want to plan a trip we can, etc. Getting married younger has been a blessing for me. I have gotten to grow while feeling stable, loved and cared for. Both my mother and my grandmother already had children by my age because they purposefully got knocked up by a random guy and I don’t respect either of them for it. No child wants to be the result of a random hook up either, trust me, I would know. My parents were never even a couple. I completely agree with everything you said about marriage and preferences. I enjoy having the time to also correct the faults in myself before having a child as I never want to put my children through what my mother put me through. I always knew I would never have a child before I was ready, I promised myself that young despite my mother and grandmother both having children before they hit their 20s. I was going to break the cycle and I did. :D You make an absolutely excellent point about finding a way to mesh the values of the time period with today so it can work for the film. I think your example of Cinderella combining the 50s values and Victorian time period is dead on. (2 of my favorite time periods by the way, the 50s being my favorite!) You are such balanced and eloquent person and it is really inspiring talking to you, by the way! (I don’t mean to make you feel weird, it’s just so refreshing and I feel that you more than deserve the credit.) Definitely Snow White’s haircut is influenced from the 30s. XD I think she was mostly influenced by Walt’s idea of a perfect wife and mother though. I know part of her design was influenced by Betty Boop at the time. The thing that bothers me the absolute most about Jasmine is the fact that they have her dressed as a harem girl when in reality, she never would have been dressed that way while she was a princess. Her father would not have nor let, her be dressed like that and in that way, it was heavily influenced by the feminist movement of the 90s where they wanted females to push boundaries, even if it had no purpose or positive result. I’m not trying to be rude here, just stating the reality relative to its time period. I also didn’t like when Jasmine ran away because similar to Rapunzel going to the bar in Tangled, realistically it would have just led to such horrible results. Jasmine could not walk around in the Middle East as a single woman with no male accompanying her and nothing bad happen. I know they showed the merchant almost cut her arm off for stealing but that was after she did something wrong. Realistically, I think she would’ve been attacked or at least stopped well before that. The Middle East does not welcome a character like Jasmine. Those men would not allow Jasmine to talk back the way she did. I have also read blogs written by Muslim women who complain about Jasmine and how her portrayal is so incredibly off. That’s how I learned she was dressed as a harem girl, a Muslim woman wrote a blog about it and complained. She even drew a more accurate dress for her as a princess. That’s why I think Jasmine is too far out of historical context and too modernized by the time period she came out in. I’ve never heard that Muslim women had more agency in their lives than European princesses. (I’ve always heard it the other way around.) Do you have any examples to enlighten me with? :) I think Beauty and the Beast did a better job. I thought it was really smart to make Belle’s father an inventor because it explained why she would be raised more progressive than the other townspeople. I agree though that part of Belle’s not fitting in has to do with them going from a higher-class to a lower-class. She does say “since we came to this poor, provincial town” showing she was not born and raised there. I believe it was implied that Maurice’s inventions were what made them bankrupt. Belle was encouraging him in the beginning and saying “I believe in you” and when her father asks “You do?”, she responds “I always have”. I thought that was implying that his inventions have failed time and time again but she still encouraged him anyway. I think the combination of them coming from a better background and her father being so interested in invention and innovation definitely made her more of a book-lover. The townspeople are also supposed to be kind of dumb, I thought. Gaston, Le Fou and the Bimbettes certainly are. I thought they did a really great balance with Belle, where she valued both reading and adventure as well as marriage and family. In the beginning, she does vent to her father about not having anyone to talk to and her father immediately asks about Gaston. I took that to mean that the father, knowing Belle very well, realized that she meant romantic companionship with a partner to talk to. I think she had a beautiful balance of traditional values and the right modern and progressive values. I also give tons of excuses with The Little Mermaid because they were working from a much more original and creative standpoint since mermaids can be pretty much whatever you want them to be as long as they are half fish and half person. I definitely and completely agree with you about Rapunzel should’ve been far more dated. She should’ve been almost as much a “fish out of water” as Ariel was out in the world (on land). I am not too familiar with Sofia the First, but I know of it. Thank you for explaining all of that to me. I agree, again, with everything you said. That is smarter to put her in a fictional kingdom so they can take liberties with mixing cultures and a TV show should go better than a film. Then things can be adapted and changed whereas with the film, you’re stuck with the one final product. I will look her up, thanks. If you don’t mind it then I would definitely encourage you to at least just watch the Rapunzel-Gothel scenes. I have also provided some of the lyrics from her songs and some pictures from the film in some of my articles, if you are interested? #6 & #2 have screen cap collages of the songs (Mother Knows Best & Reprise) and some quotes from the songs that I thought worth pointing out: http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/disney-princess/articles/249727/title/dp-villain-songs-countdown #3 explains how horrible and why I think Mother Gothel is one of the most villainous villains. Also includes quotes and a collage: http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/disney-princess/articles/249486/title/dp-villains-countdown-rated-pg-13 Towards the bottom, there is a GREAT photo that illustrates how Gothel & Rapunzel’s relationship is kind of similar to Joan Crawford and Christina Crawford in “Mommie Dearest”: http://www.fanpop.com/clubs/disney-princess/articles/249251/title/disney-princess-favorite-movies I’ve explained the Gothel-Rapunzel stuff much better in those articles. :) Wow, I have never heard of this “road-trip films” but you are absolutely right about everything you said. Another thing I personally don’t like about the modern films is that I find that they have a very crude humor that none of the classics or renaissance films had. There was some off-beat humor, for lack of a better phrase, in Mulan but it was much classier. There are some jokes in Princess and the Frog, Tangled, Brave and Frozen that just make me feel uncomfortable for a children’s film. Completely unnecessary and irrelative to the plot. Also, not just crude but a bit violent as well. Most notably, Mama Odie and Anna with Hans. Perhaps that is what you mean by emphasis on humor that really isn’t that funny? I don’t find those things funny either. Personally, I love the humor in the renaissance the most. I love the puns and hardy-har-har humor. Things like when Sebastian tells Ariel “You’re under a lot of pressure….” That was just really clever to me and funny in the best way. I love that style of humor. In America, it’s known as very “mid-western humor”. The “mid-western” region’s capitol is Chicago, Illinois where Walt Disney happened to be born and I think his work reflects it a lot as well. The mid-west also has a lot of family values. :D Wow I think you’re absolutely right that Louis should have been under Facilier’s spell. I also like the idea of Facilier vs. Mama Odie which would be an homage to one of my favorites, Sword in the Stone, where Merlin took on Mad Madam Mim! Wow again! I completely agree with you about the frog hunters being the worst part of the bayou scenes, along with meeting Mama Odie aside from the song “Dig a Little Deeper” (which I like). Another thing personally that I don’t like about Princess and the Frog that stands out and bothers me is Tiana’s character change which I think can be attributed to your explanation of the degradation of the story as a whole after the beginning of the film. It seemed to me like when Tiana was a human, she was compassionate, understanding, caring and overall a good person despite working too much. Right in the scene on the balcony with Naveen as a frog though, it’s like her character totally changes. She knows Naveen thinks she’s a princess because they’re both looking at the picture and he says “This is it! You must kiss me.” And he calls her “princess” as a name all before they kiss. It never made sense to me why she, in my opinion, lied about being a princess. Bad script writing just to turn her into the frog in my opinion. In the beginning of the film, Tiana runs away from a frog and screams. When she sees Naveen as a frog, she hits him with a book. Granted he speaks but he also speaks for quite a bit before she hits him, after he’s explained himself?! Then as a frog, Tiana becomes downright rude and catty. She often starts things with Naveen before he has done anything. She throws an acorn on his head to wake him up, which is unnecessarily violent, and she makes constant remarks at his expense even when he hasn’t disrespected her yet. Then towards the middle-end, she flip flops between the two. What do you think about Tiana’s character development over the film? It’s interesting that Disney made Tiana focused on her restaurant to go against a stereotype because I thought part of her character was based on “Madam CJ Walker” who was a black woman and the first female millionaire in America. I think there was an attempt to make Naveen more honorable, than there was for Eugene. Though I don’t like either. In the beginning, Naveen has these women clamoring over him who are all dressed up but he leaves them because he is distracted by the band. Then while he is out with the band, he sees Tiana working as a waitress in her uniform and he is now distracted from the band, and tries to talk to Tiana. (He takes his hat off and tries to greet her without words.) She immediately rejects him, he shrugs it off and moves on. I think that was an attempt to show that Naveen was naturally attracted to Tiana in a “love at first sight” type way but it happened so quickly that it’s really easy to miss if you’re not dissecting the film (which I recently did somewhat). What makes me the most upset about the Naveen/Tiana relationship is the fact that realistically, he would’ve been living off of her hard work and cheating on her after the film ended. That’s not the kind of relationship that should be pushed to young girls at all, of any race etc. I think Tiana only “fell in love” with Naveen because he had fallen for her and it flattered her because she hadn’t dated or been courted ever before. As she said “This is the nicest thing anyone’s ever done for me” when Naveen presented her with the little meal on the Riverboat. Not a great romance. People complain about Snow White and Cinderella’s Princes (especially Snow White’s) not having enough character development but at least we knew they were valiant, honorable, romantic men. That was a great partner for young girls to aspire to. That’s also again why I see Beast and Kristoff as so different than Eugene and Naveen, the former 2 would never have proactively put their princesses in danger and quite oppositely both saved their princesses before having any kind of relationship; the latter 2 proactively or by proxy put their princesses in danger and only saved them after they were saved by their princess and only did it as part of the journey. Beast and Kristoff both sacrificed themselves somewhat early on with Belle and Anna, respectively, with the wolves (in both films) though they barely knew these girls. I attribute that to the natural gentlemen that was buried in them, waiting for the princesses to uncover. I didn’t see that buried in Naveen or Eugene at all. (But again, I did with Aladdin who also sacrificed himself early on being a gentleman trying to save Jasmine.) Anyways, I agree with you about Lawrence and Nathaniel. At least you’re aware of these groups and different classifications etc. That just can’t be said for most Americans. It’s quite ridiculous actually considering how obsessed with race they are. It’s tough when it comes to races because some scientists go based only on skull shapes which results in only 3 races: Caucasoid, Mongoloid and Negroid. Some scientists go more genetically and they get anywhere from 3-9 usually. When I did different genetic tests, they had different regions. The first one had 9: 1. Sub-Saharan African; 2. South African; 3. Mediterranean- Southern Europe & Northern Africa (Sardinia, Italy, Greece, Lebanon, Egypt, Tunisia, etc.); 4. Northern European- Northern Europe (UK, Denmark, Finland, Russia, Germany etc.); 5. Southwest Asian- India & neighboring populations (Tajikistan, Iran, etc.); 6. Southeast Asian- Southeast Asia & India (particularly northeast India & Vietnam region); 7. Oceanian- all of those islands near Oceania (Papua New Guinea, Melanesia, Polynesia, etc.); 8. Northeast Asian- northeast Asia (Japan, China and Mongolia); & 9. Native American- natives to both north and south America. The second genetic test I did had only 6 regions: 1. Africa- covered all Africa; 2. America- natives of North America, Central America, South America; 3. Asia- subgroups East (Russia, China, North Korea, South Korea, Mongolia, Myanmar (Burma), Japan, Taiwan, Philippines, Indonesia, Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, Singapore, Brunei, Palau) & South (India, Pakistan, Nepal, Bhutan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka) & Asia Central (Afghanistan, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan); 4. Europe- subgroups of Great Britain (England, Scotland, Wales) & Europe East (Poland, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Austria, Russia, Hungary, Slovenia, Romania, Serbia, Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova, Lithuania, Latvia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia) & Iberian Peninsula (Spain, Portugal) & European Jewish (Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, Russia, Hungary, Israel) & Italy/Greece & Europe West (Belgium, France, Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, Luxembourg, Liechtenstein) & Finland/Northwest Russia & Ireland (Ireland, Wales, Scotland) & Scandinavia (Sweden, Norway, Denmark); 5. Pacific Islander- subgroups of Polynesia (Tonga, Samoa, Fiji, New Zealand (Maori), Micronesia, Philippines, Melanesia, Hawaii) & Melanesia (Papua New Guinea, Bougainville, Fiji, Aboriginal Australia, Solomon Islands, New Caledonia) & 6. West Asia- subgroups Caucasus (Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Turkey) & Middle East (Syria, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Oman, Yemen, United Arab Emirates (UAE), Lebanon, Israel). So I consider Russians and Arabians to both be Caucasians and on the 3 racial skull system, they have Caucasoid skulls. They also have more values that are in line with Caucasians than Asians overall. Though I believe it was Winston Churchill who said “Russians are Eurasian” because they’re so uniquely both. Semitics overall are considered Caucasian so that would also be another point for arabs to be considered Caucasian. I think Turks are usually considered a subgroup of Caucasian as well. For some countries like India, I think it depends on which region. India borders with so many different regions. I’m pretty sure Romani is Caucasian as well, as you said. Wow! I have never heard of someone calling Indonesian people “Spanish”. That’s just awful. By the way most people who use the word “Hispanic” don’t even know what it means. When you see someone using tht word, it’s a big indicator that they don’t know much about genetics, race, or ethnicities. Most of them don’t realize Hispania is an island and “Hispanic” actually means a person of the island of Hispania. They will use the word to mean people who “speak Spanish” or people who are “half Spanish” or people who are from “latin countries” etc. It’s one of the worst words going around the American populous and media right now. Thank you so much for sharing that story with me about Mulan! That is hilarious that she was originally not meant as a feminist icon but to shame the men. That also makes way more sense with Asian culture in general. Thank you so much for clearing that up for me! I always wondered if there was really some lone feminist poet in Asia that they actually allowed to right a feminist poem like that. This makes way more sense! (And you were right, it was funny! :D) I think the feminist portrayal is not only a result of different time but mainly different culture as well. In America, there is a feminist culture and there are feminists who fight for women to be in the army more even though many women who did make it, come on TV and say they regretted it because they realized women’s bodies weren’t made for that physical strain and lots of women who join the army end up losing the ability and choice to get pregnant and start families later. I agree with you that most of the criticism towards a British prince charming and Chinese girl would be from western audiences. Well, Naveen was still Caucasian, was he not? Seems to me they just traded a northern European/British prince for a Southern European/Mediterranean prince which means he was still a “white” man in the end with a tan. This is exactly what I was talking about my problem with audiences when it comes to race and non-european princesses. Who cares what his race is? Shouldn’t his personality be FAR more important? That’s why I see those people as plain racist. They let their obsession with race far outweigh the more important things in life and it often blinds them to the reality of the situation. I can’t tell you how often someone will complain that they experienced racism just because the person who was being a jerk to them was of a different race. They never consider the fact that the person is just a jerk, not a racist. Wow, I mean this as the highest compliment when I say you do not come off American at all! Too smart, too cultured, too balanced. :D It’s a pleasure for me to know there are women like you still in this country. Thank you for allowing me to get to know this about you, it makes me feel better about the country I live in. I am very similar, lived in America my whole life but always been more traditionally-minded, naturally. I attribute it to the high rate of Asian genetics that I have. I grew up with an incredibly liberal mother who had an incredibly liberal mother herself and I saw them both take things way too far so it also made me swing a little bit more conservative than I might have naturally been. It certainly made me a little pickier and more cautious. It’s sad but my mother and grandmother are 2 of the absolute worst women I have ever known. They are both embodiments of feminism and liberalism gone too far. They take advantage of others and exploit their gender to do it. I never wanted to be like them and it has made me very conservative though I am very open-minded academically, just not as much socially. My husband is more socially liberal than I (but not too much) and he constantly helps me see things more balanced when I am not. Honestly, you are the first person I have ever met who I respect and admire that loves Jasmine so much. If you feel comfortable, we can have a private message about her and I’d love to hear your case for her. You are very eloquent and I think if anyone stands a chance at changing my view of her, it would be you right now. Also, admittedly, I have a lot of Jasmine in me and they are the parts about me that I dislike the most. I am not spoiled as I did not grow up that way at all but I can get feisty, stubborn and I prefer bluntness. My mother and grandmother were much more like Jasmine than I was, the worst parts. I ended up living in an environment with this combativeness all the time, 24/7, and it gave me a great distaste for it. I hate to admit that I have picked up some of those habits and I have been working so hard to try and shed them over the last few years. I’m not trying to become demure but I don’t want to come off antagonistic. That’s how I feel Jasmine is, very antagonistic and not balanced. If Jasmine’s personality was more like yours, I would like her A LOT more. Also her character was originally supposed to be a more stereotypical Chinese “dragon lady”, if you know what I mean, and luckily they toned her down. Part of why Belle and Cinderella are my favorite is because I love their balance and the way they handle things with such grace and class. That is exactly what I want to achieve one day. I absolutely love and adore Ever After! I would definitely recommend it. I don’t normally like the modern adaptations of Cinderella stories but I really loved this one. I thought it was so genuine and well done. Good acting and as I said, great incorporation of Leonardo da Vinci. I don’t know exactly what you saw so I don’t want to exactly “give anything away” but if you do see it, I’d love to hear your opinion on it. I thought it was really moving and touching. I used to own it on VHS and watch it all the time. It kind of makes Cinderella a mixture of Cinderella and Belle in some ways, which is probably why I love it so much! Thanks for the warning on that book. I don’t think I’ll be looking into it after all as I am very sensitive to rape. :) Thank you though. I'm glad you enjoy our discussions as well. :)

laylastepford I forgot to mention, I don't think Jasmine was talking back to the men in the marketplace, I meant that I thought Jasmine "talked back" in general, to everyone. I never noticed the other people in the marketplace of higher stations buying from the vendors, I will have to look for that next time! Thank you for pointing it out. When it comes to the crude humor from the film PATF, I would say there was definitely a bit though a lot of it overall was inappropriate. Some examples would be: 1. Shows off Naveen’s playboy attitude “A great big party every night. That doesn’t sound too bad. A redhead on my left arm, a brunette on my right, a blonde or two to hold the candles. Now that seems just about right.” Why in the world would Tiana logically be attracted to this guy? He’s flirting with butterflies as a frog! I agree with you 100% that Frozen had some shocking innuendos that made me question if I was hearing it properly the first time I saw it. 2. I personally find Ray to be a little inappropriate with his choice of humor for children. “I just got my big butt glowing! That’s right! The women like a man with a big back porch!” do children need to know that? (And I thought he was monogamous with the star “Evangeline” so what does it matter to him and why would he mention what other women like about him?) 3. Mama Odie kisses a snake tongue to mouth which was incredibly gross to watch [as Louis demonstrated]. 4. Mama Odie asked “How’s your grandmamma?” And Ray responded “She’s fine. Got in a little trouble for flashing the neighbors again.” Which was inappropriate enough but got worse with Mama Odie endorsing that kind of behavior with “Ooh, I like that gal’s spunk!” Not family-friendly. 5. Charlotte asking the little brother how old he is [6½] and saying “Well I waited this long!” was also inappropriate and pretty gross. No problem! I'm glad my taking those DNA tests helped someone else out! :D Because so many Americans are so sensitive to genetics, I think that's also why it's harder to find all of that stuff in one place. Too many Americans get upset whereas if you pay for the test then you're already more open to genetic stuff. Hence, the genetic categories not showing up until you get the results. That's super cool that you live in Texas! I have only ever been there once but I had the best steak that I have ever had in my entire life ever and I want to go back for another. :D Seriously, it was delicious and left an impression. I'm jealous! I live in Southern California where people think "Mexican" is it's own race, not nationality or ethnicity. Additionally, there are tons of people who think they are "Mexican" even though they weren't born in Mexico, don't have parents who were born in Mexico, have never actually been to Mexico, don't know anything about Mexico, don't know anyone who does live in Mexico, but had some relative somewhere 3+ generations back who was born or lived in Mexico..... Yes, "Hispania" used to be colloquial speech for the Iberian Peninsula (Spain & Portugal) which was seen as an "island" by the Romans. The name means "island of the rabbit". Eventually that term was dropped until around the 12th century. In America, people who descended from "Mexicans" used to call themselves "chicanos" but for whatever reason, didn't want to use that term anymore. So within the last few decades, most likely some uncultured person in America thought "Hispanic" meant "half-Spanish" and started using it that way. (Since mexicans are actually usually mestizo (half European & half Amerindian) or full European.) Eventually, it became the substitute for "chicano" and "latino" by many Americans, primarily in California. It makes no sense and serves no purpose other than them trying to present themselves as a social group. Also most of them don't realize that they're half-European. They also don't realize that Spain and Portugal are European... despite being countries in Europe. I think Naveen's language is an Italian/French hybrid as well, is it not? I know when he says certain words that are supposed to be in his native language, they are untranslatable by modern known languages. I definitely consider him to be Mediterranean because supposedly "Maldonia" is supposed to be a cross between the small island south of Sicily named "Malta" and "Macedonia" which borders Greece, Albania and Bulgaria. I think Disney put themselves in a bind by placing Tiana's story in the 1920s when there weren't many kings and princes left to begin with. I have never seen the concept art of Naveen but I would much prefer him to have looked more dashing and less flirty. I am very interested in worldly outlooks and the differences in perceptions between cultures and races etc. For this reason, I completely agree with you about liking the characters' races to be known. Personally, I like to think of them in different time periods including modern/present interacting with each other and how those differences would play out. Wow, clearly the person you had been talking to was the culturally ignorant one themselves. English people aren't culturally ignorant, they tend to be much more cultured than Americans. That's what America is known for. Anyone who has lived or traveled or known people who live in other places, knows that America has a reputation everywhere else for having less cultured people. We are seen as the "violent and uncultured Americans". No need to thank me for my views on you though, they're merely reflecting what I see. :D Thank you so much for your kind words and compliment about me being a good mother some day! Coming from a line of atrocious women who shouldn't have been mothers, that means a lot to me! <3 Not to be crude or anything but I read a study that you might find interesting. The result was that the majority of Americans will never travel farther than the waste in their toilet does. Not only are many Americans not aware of the world outside of US borders, but there are also many who aren't aware of the world outside of their state or even city. I am so sorry that you have to deal with some of that in Texas. I have been there and I have experienced some of the culture. There are many things that I adore and love about Texas culture and a few things I don't. Much like America, I also know Texas is like 5 countries rolled in one. I know there are some parts of Texas that have very "small town" thinking. As someone who lives in Southern California though, I must admit that I'm a bit jealous of you. :) One thing I do admire about Texas culture that So. California culture doesn't have is the self-responsibility, accountability and family values. Believe it or not, the people you are dealing with in Texas sound the same if not somewhat better than a lot of the people I had to deal with in school. There's such an emphasis on looks, sexuality and superficial things where I live that the people have gotten to be REALLY stupid. I used to train people how to work the cash register at my old job and you wouldn't believe how many girls couldn't handle basic counting... despite the register having a calculator and doing 98% of the math for them! (All they had to do was count the change back right!) It's incredibly frustrating. Well if you do give Ever After another go, please let me know what you think. I grew up a lot like Rapunzel on my mom's side but I also grew up a lot like Cinderella on my dad's side and had a stepmother and 2 half-sisters. The movie Ever After is even more accurate to that part of my life than Disney's Cinderella (primarily because 1 sister isn't quite as bad as the other in Ever After). I love the "Ever After" version a bit more for that reason, personally. It really speaks to me so I admit there's a huge personal bias there but I do love the way the story went and ended. :) Wow! A child's book with rape in it? That's amazing! I never thought that could be possible.